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 Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.

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PostSubject: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:44 pm

I decided to make a new thread for this since the General JW News Thread wasn't the best spot for it.

Today, Universal via their JW social media sites said that the JW Spino skeleton was that of the JP3 Spinosaurus.



There are 5 MAJOR problems with this:

1. Sorna is 87 miles away from Nublar. The 'new' Spinosaurus might be able to swim that far, but not the JP3 Spinosaurus.

2. The JP3 Spinosaurus was at least 50ft. That skeleton is roughly Rexy's length, if not slightly smaller.

3. The JP3 Spinosaurus had a much smaller sail. This skeleton has a much larger one.

4. The JP3 Spino had two hornlets, one above each eye. This one has a Baryonyx sized crest above each eye.

5. How did it die? Since it couldn't swim to Nublar and lose to Rexy, then it had to be killed off somehow? And they wouldn't have killed it off unless Masrani had a good reason. And I just can't fathom a good one.

Here's a picture of the JP3 Spino.




And here's the JW Spino Skeleton.




Based on this, I take away 3 things from all of this.

1. Universal is really this stupid to think that what happened in JW solved what happened in JP3. (Which it clearly didn't.)

2. They really don't care about the product and the fans-except for their cash.

3. They just don't deserve the rights anymore. It's time for new ownership.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:08 pm

Okay, so they made ONE stupid and ultimately superfluous retcon, one that really not that many people will probably pick up on or especially care about. But advocating that the rights revert back to the Crichton estate over this? If Jurassic Park 5/World 2 sucks, then I'll probably start discussing that in earnest, but this is more indicative of marketing people not knowing their dinosaurs well. Certainly not as well as us die hard fans.

What does this really tell me? This is only a social media gimmick, not something that Bayona or Trevorrow mutually agreed upon and broadcasted. If I were feeling ungenerous towards Trevorrow, I might say that it would be something he would have set in stone by spelling it out for us in JW, but he didn't. Unless someone has information that aligns differently with what I say. The studio executives are not the filmmakers, and vice versa. I just hope they stay out of the creative affairs of the next two films.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:12 pm

I already said what I had to say on that other thread, you know about the possible different interpretations, but let me just add one thing.

Whatever Universal may or may not try to say, in the end it is just some cheap PR video... so we don't have to care about it when it comes to the films itself. Just like I don't care what the Masrani marketing web site, or JP:TG or whatever other off brand tries to claim has happened in the universe. Unless it's specified clearly inside the movies, it's not canon in that verse. Not facts. And even then of course you can trash everything with head canons.

Now, if this thing somehow actually were to be canonized in JP5: while it would still be retarded, there would one very slight silver lining: finally admitting that TLW and JP3 actually happened.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:15 pm

@BarrytheOnyx wrote:
Okay, so they made ONE stupid and ultimately superfluous retcon, one that really not that many people will probably pick up on or especially care about. But advocating that the rights revert back to the Crichton estate over this?  If Jurassic Park 5/World 2 sucks, then I'll probably start discussing that in earnest, but this is more indicative of marketing people not knowing their dinosaurs well. Certainly not as well as us die hard fans.

What does this really tell me? This is only a social media gimmick, not something that Bayona or Trevorrow mutually agreed upon and broadcasted. If I were feeling ungenerous towards Trevorrow, I might say that it would be something he would have set in stone by spelling it out for us in JW, but he didn't. Unless someone has information that aligns differently with what I say. The studio executives are not the filmmakers, and vice versa. I just hope they stay out of the creative affairs of the next two films.

It's not so much about this per se. It's about how to on-again off-again relationship Universal seems to have with JP fans and the frachise in general since JP3. First they outright ignored them in JP3, then they claimed to care it when JW was being made after 12 years of chaos, then they tried to hide Sorna while trying to acknowledge it as as canon, and now they are trying to shove this down our throats and have us believe it. Universal seemed to stop caring about the fanbase and franchise in general-except for the money that is-for a while and this is just a further sign of that.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:58 pm

If theyre honestly rolling with this, it's because the Rex fanboys still wont shut the hell up about a Rex/Spino rematch in any future film and this is to silence those calls. It's why Trevorrow came out for the last one and said the skeleton was an easter egg to the 3rd movie and the scene where the Spino smashed through that barrier.

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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:03 pm

I'm praying it's just a intern who is really detached and Universal isn't that lazy. 

Either way, it doesn't really matter to me. UNLESS. They want to keep pushing this whole fight thing in the next film like it's not over. 

Like if the Rex comes out of nowhere and thrashes the Baryonyx or if they have lines or references that keep pushing the fight thing in an unnatural way.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:09 pm

Im thinking it was just a website exclusive thing, because as of today they stiil have the Dilo's page from the first movie up nor do they have the Spino one up. Plus all the designs of the animals still dont match the ones from the film.

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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:12 pm

@Troyal1 wrote:
I'm praying it's just a intern who is really detached and Universal isn't that lazy. 

Like if the Rex comes out of nowhere and thrashes the Baryonyx or if they have lines or references that keep pushing the fight thing in an unnatural way.

Unfortunately, given Universal's odd relationship with the franchise and the fanbase, I'm willing to say that Universal really is that lazy.


With all that being said, I honesty don't think that they'll have Rexy beat up on the Baryonyx. It would feel too much like a watered down rematch like how Rexy destroyed the Spino skeleton was. And even if it did, it wouldn't work since even die-hard T. rex fanboys would not like seeing a relative of Spinosaurus get punished for something that it never did wrong by itself. They hate Spino, but they can still like Baryonyx.

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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:38 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Troyal1 wrote:
I'm praying it's just a intern who is really detached and Universal isn't that lazy. 

Like if the Rex comes out of nowhere and thrashes the Baryonyx or if they have lines or references that keep pushing the fight thing in an unnatural way.

Unfortunately, given Universal's odd relationship with the franchise and the fanbase, I'm willing to say that Universal really is that lazy.


With all that being said, I honesty don't think that they'll have Rexy beat up on the Baryonyx. It would feel too much like a watered down rematch like how Rexy destroyed the Spino skeleton was. And even if it did, it wouldn't work since even die-hard T. rex fanboys would not like seeing a relative of Spinosaurus get punished for something that it never did wrong by itself. They hate Spino, but they can still like Baryonyx.

I get what you're saying totally. But at the same time Universal thought it would be good enough for a Rex to beat a skeleton lol.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 7:13 am

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Spinosaurus is the only easter egg in the entire film that is not from Jurassic Park. There is not a single one from TLW. There's the Malcolm book which Grant refers in JP3, but that doesn't require it to be the same one, just general reference because *Malcolm*. And the reason for this is that they know GA and even most of the fans only care of the first film. Also it's advocated that Trevorrow doesn't like the sequels either. So again, they might be highlighting the articulation of 'Jurassic Park 3' for dumb masses who have either not seen in TLW/JP3, don't remember, or care to remember. Not being mean spirited. Apart from obviously trying to make fanservice with the destruction of the skeleton for HC fans that is.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:19 am

It's not the same animal. Everyone can see that. This is a shitty lame excuse of Universal as a fanservice to shut up the hell out of these stupid fanboys that ARE STILL BUTTHURT over a scene that happened 14 years ago in a movie. I have no sympathy for those fuckers, I'm actually angry this is still a thing.

They aren't even real dinosaur fans, they just pick the most mainstream dinosaur like it is their ultimate pokemon and can't accept the fact that T.rex was an animal that could lose or win a fight, it depends. But no, it's the god of dinosaurs so it can't lose because those crybabies aren't mature enough to get over a stupid fight scene.

I hate those bastards. They are the sub human scum of this franchise and paleo community. They are the worst. A disgrace. You don't see the most annoying Spinosaurus fanboy (And I've saw a lot of ones) doing this type of sh*t. It's always those T.rex fanboys. They are so annoying that I sometimes start to rant my rage over Tyrannosaurus, while the animal has no fault to have such a vile and toxic "fan" base.

I'm really sorry for the slurs, but this thing was just too much for me. It's not the same animal, Universal can say whatever they want, it isn't canon and this is just for these lowlifes to accept already what happened.

And they are so lucky I'm not Colin Trevorrow, because if they kept whinning about Spinosaurus, I would put a Triceratops stabbing the hell out of a Tyrannosaurus. Hell, what were they going to do? Delete Triceratops? Hate triceratops and make it the new jar jar binks too? What about denying science and paleontology? Go argue with nature, since it's already proven a Triceratops survived a T.rex attack and could actually kill one. 

Bastards. Just leave Spinosaurus alone. You got what you wanted, it's never going to be back. It is an incredible animal that get's unfair hate because of stupid piece of shits that don't even deserve to be called dino fans. Damnit, I think they want every JP movie to open with a Spinosaurus getting killed, smashed and eaten by a T.rex.

And guess what? This won't delete the canon scene where Spinosaurus killed the Tyrannosaurus. It still killed the T.rex and nothing is going to change that. JP3 Spino will die one day, Rexy will too. Wow, such a revenge huh?

And some people say I exagerate when I talk about fanboys, specially about this. I don't think so. By the way, I'm not saying everyone that likes T.rex is that. I'm talking about the extreme immature ones, the fanboys basically. The ones that if you say you like Spinosaurus and it's actually a cool animal despite what it did, they will go after your throat.

I really hope Baryonyx or another Spinosaurid makes it to JW2. I also want to see cool scenes with them. You can't just delete them, you bastards. Spinosaurids will come back.


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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:25 am

@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
It's not the same animal. Everyone can see that. This is a shitty lame excuse of Universal as a fanservice to shut up the hell out of these stupid fanboys that ARE STILL BUTTHURT over a scene that happened 14 years ago in a movie. I have no sympathy for those fuckers, I'm actually angry this is still a thing.

They aren't even real dinosaur fans, they just pick the most mainstream dinosaur like it is their ultimate pokemon and can't accept the fact that T.rex was an animal that could lose or win a fight, it depends. But no, it's the god of dinosaurs so it can't loose because those crybabies aren't mature enough to get over a stupid fight scene.

I hate those bastards. They are the sub human scum of this franchise and paleo community. They are the worst. A disgrace. You don't see the most annoying Spinosaurus fanboy (And I've saw a lot of ones) doing this type of sh*t. It's always those T.rex fanboys. They are so annoying that I sometimes start to rant my rage over Tyrannosaurus, while the animal has no fault to have such a vile and toxic "fan" base.

I'm really sorry for the slurs, but this thing was just too much for me. It's not the same animal, Universal can say whatever they want, it isn't canon and this is just for these lowlifes to accept already what happened.

And they are so lucky I'm not Colin Trevorrow, because if they kept whinning about Spinosaurus, I would put a Triceratops stabbing the hell out of a Tyrannosaurus. Hell, what were they going to do? Delete Triceratops? Hate triceratops and make it the new jar jar binks too? What about denying science and paleontology? Go argue with nature, since it's already proven a Triceratops survived a T.rex attack and could actually kill one. 

Bastards. Just leave Spinosaurus alone. You got what you wanted, it's never going to be back. It is an incredible animal that get's unfair hate because of stupid piece of shits that don't even deserve to be called dino fans.

And guess what? This won't delete the canon scene where Spinosaurus killed the Tyrannosaurus. It still killed the T.rex and nothing is going to change that. JP3 Spino will die one day, Rexy will too. Wow, such a revenge huh?

And some people say I exagerate when I talk about fanboys, specially about this. I don't think so.

Yo do realize that you're turning into what you're hating, if you haven't turned into it already, right? Also, if you're going to blame the fanbase, then shouldn't you also blame Horner for starting all this in the first place, as well as the higher ups for letting him do this as well? There's more then enough blame to go around, here.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:38 am

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
It's not the same animal. Everyone can see that. This is a shitty lame excuse of Universal as a fanservice to shut up the hell out of these stupid fanboys that ARE STILL BUTTHURT over a scene that happened 14 years ago in a movie. I have no sympathy for those fuckers, I'm actually angry this is still a thing.

They aren't even real dinosaur fans, they just pick the most mainstream dinosaur like it is their ultimate pokemon and can't accept the fact that T.rex was an animal that could lose or win a fight, it depends. But no, it's the god of dinosaurs so it can't loose because those crybabies aren't mature enough to get over a stupid fight scene.

I hate those bastards. They are the sub human scum of this franchise and paleo community. They are the worst. A disgrace. You don't see the most annoying Spinosaurus fanboy (And I've saw a lot of ones) doing this type of sh*t. It's always those T.rex fanboys. They are so annoying that I sometimes start to rant my rage over Tyrannosaurus, while the animal has no fault to have such a vile and toxic "fan" base.

I'm really sorry for the slurs, but this thing was just too much for me. It's not the same animal, Universal can say whatever they want, it isn't canon and this is just for these lowlifes to accept already what happened.

And they are so lucky I'm not Colin Trevorrow, because if they kept whinning about Spinosaurus, I would put a Triceratops stabbing the hell out of a Tyrannosaurus. Hell, what were they going to do? Delete Triceratops? Hate triceratops and make it the new jar jar binks too? What about denying science and paleontology? Go argue with nature, since it's already proven a Triceratops survived a T.rex attack and could actually kill one. 

Bastards. Just leave Spinosaurus alone. You got what you wanted, it's never going to be back. It is an incredible animal that get's unfair hate because of stupid piece of shits that don't even deserve to be called dino fans.

And guess what? This won't delete the canon scene where Spinosaurus killed the Tyrannosaurus. It still killed the T.rex and nothing is going to change that. JP3 Spino will die one day, Rexy will too. Wow, such a revenge huh?

And some people say I exagerate when I talk about fanboys, specially about this. I don't think so.

Yo do realize that you're turning into what you're hating, if you haven't turned into it already, right? Also, if you're going to blame the fanbase, then shouldn't you also blame Horner for starting all this in the first place, as well as the higher ups for letting him do this as well? There's more then enough blame to go around, here.
Don't excuse what they are doing. You know this is STILL a real thing. They are still there. They exist. You don't need to search for too long to see it. And what Universal did with this poor excuse of a "fanservice" is try to shut up them for good by having something totally out of logic.

I'm not a fanboy. I like Spinosaurus, but I'm not a fanboy like "Yolololo it killed the rex cry more T.rex fans lolololo" in every topic about Spinosaurus/T.rex.

I actually  talk a lot with T.rex fans and we have a mutual respect, they are all mature and are like "Hey, I grew up and I actually saw how stupid it is to hate Spinosaurus. Now I find it so cool." and "Hey, no need for a rematch, just leave it be, we already had Rexy in her full glory, I'm happy.". But there is still the shitty piece of meatbags that still want a rematch, still go in every Spino topic (even in paleo places) talk trash about the dinosaur, and I'm directing my words TOWARDS those. 

I hate them with a great passion, because they only did damage so far, they are toxic. They don't love dinosaurs. They love the Tyrannosaurus. Only it. Every other dinosaur they compare to Tyrannosaurus like "was it able to kill a rex? No, so it sucks". They are a disgrace to the whole fandom and paleo community. They don't bring anything positive.  Don't try dennying that, because I see it everytime. When I search about theropods, and then the talk is full of "Huuurr but how it is compared to the T.rex hurrrr". I'm actually avoiding reading about paleontology because of that.

And of course I blame everyone who had this great idea to put Spinosaurus to kill a T.rex. But the fanboys are to blame too. THEY ARE THE ONES that made Spinosaurus the jar jar binks of JP franchise, by hating it like immature crybabies that they are.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:07 pm

Alright uhh so we're gonna tone it down a tad before it blows up into something it shouldnt. Not saying to not mention the Spinosaurus in general, but we dont need the conversation around the animal to get as bad as it did on JPL.

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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:38 pm

I am this close to signing off permanently.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:06 pm

@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
It's not the same animal. Everyone can see that. This is a shitty lame excuse of Universal as a fanservice to shut up the hell out of these stupid fanboys that ARE STILL BUTTHURT over a scene that happened 14 years ago in a movie. I have no sympathy for those fuckers, I'm actually angry this is still a thing.

They aren't even real dinosaur fans, they just pick the most mainstream dinosaur like it is their ultimate pokemon and can't accept the fact that T.rex was an animal that could lose or win a fight, it depends. But no, it's the god of dinosaurs so it can't loose because those crybabies aren't mature enough to get over a stupid fight scene.

I hate those bastards. They are the sub human scum of this franchise and paleo community. They are the worst. A disgrace. You don't see the most annoying Spinosaurus fanboy (And I've saw a lot of ones) doing this type of sh*t. It's always those T.rex fanboys. They are so annoying that I sometimes start to rant my rage over Tyrannosaurus, while the animal has no fault to have such a vile and toxic "fan" base.

I'm really sorry for the slurs, but this thing was just too much for me. It's not the same animal, Universal can say whatever they want, it isn't canon and this is just for these lowlifes to accept already what happened.

And they are so lucky I'm not Colin Trevorrow, because if they kept whinning about Spinosaurus, I would put a Triceratops stabbing the hell out of a Tyrannosaurus. Hell, what were they going to do? Delete Triceratops? Hate triceratops and make it the new jar jar binks too? What about denying science and paleontology? Go argue with nature, since it's already proven a Triceratops survived a T.rex attack and could actually kill one.

Bastards. Just leave Spinosaurus alone. You got what you wanted, it's never going to be back. It is an incredible animal that get's unfair hate because of stupid piece of shits that don't even deserve to be called dino fans.

And guess what? This won't delete the canon scene where Spinosaurus killed the Tyrannosaurus. It still killed the T.rex and nothing is going to change that. JP3 Spino will die one day, Rexy will too. Wow, such a revenge huh?

And some people say I exagerate when I talk about fanboys, specially about this. I don't think so.

Yo do realize that you're turning into what you're hating, if you haven't turned into it already, right? Also, if you're going to blame the fanbase, then shouldn't you also blame Horner for starting all this in the first place, as well as the higher ups for letting him do this as well? There's more then enough blame to go around, here.
Don't excuse what they are doing. You know this is STILL a real thing. They are still there. They exist. You don't need to search for too long to see it. And what Universal did with this poor excuse of a "fanservice" is try to shut up them for good by having something totally out of logic.

I'm not a fanboy. I like Spinosaurus, but I'm not a fanboy like "Yolololo it killed the rex cry more T.rex fans lolololo" in every topic about Spinosaurus/T.rex.

I actually talk a lot with T.rex fans and we have a mutual respect, they are all mature and are like "Hey, I grew up and I actually saw how stupid it is to hate Spinosaurus. Now I find it so cool." and "Hey, no need for a rematch, just leave it be, we already had Rexy in her full glory, I'm happy.". But there is still the shitty piece of meatbags that still want a rematch, still go in every Spino topic (even in paleo places) talk trash about the dinosaur, and I'm directing my words TOWARDS those.

I hate them with a great passion, because they only did damage so far, they are toxic. They don't love dinosaurs. They love the Tyrannosaurus. Only it. Every other dinosaur they compare to Tyrannosaurus like "was it able to kill a rex? No, so it sucks". They are a disgrace to the whole fandom and paleo community. They don't bring anything positive. Don't try dennying that, because I see it everytime. When I search about theropods, and then the talk is full of "Huuurr but how it is compared to the T.rex hurrrr". I'm actually avoiding reading about paleontology because of that.

And of course I blame everyone who had this great idea to put Spinosaurus to kill a T.rex. But the fanboys are to blame too. THEY ARE THE ONES that made Spinosaurus the jar jar binks of JP franchise, by hating it like immature crybabies that they are.


@Dead2009 wrote:
Alright uhh so we're gonna tone it down a tad before it blows up into something it shouldnt. Not saying to not mention the Spinosaurus in general, but we dont need the conversation around the animal to get as bad as it did on JPL.

He's right, you do need to clam down. I can't help but wonder if you're risking getting banned for a while because of this. We can disagree, but there's no need for you to act like this.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:46 pm

I'm allowing the discussion to stay open, but let's keep it chill. I would hate to see the rule of "no Spino/JPIII" talk put back into place.

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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:17 pm

We did a write up on this ridiculousness: http://jurassic-pedia.com/something-ridiculous/
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:29 pm

@CT-1138 wrote:
We did a write up on this ridiculousness: http://jurassic-pedia.com/something-ridiculous/

Yeah, I read that yesterday. The thing is that because of this, from here on out, whatever Universal says is canon-like the Masrani backdoor site-will either be ignored/treated as non-canon or be debated until canon is established. I asked TDJ if he's considering the Masrani backdoor site non-canon due to all this and his words were "I am. Actually." I don't think Universal thought about that when it did this.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:51 pm

Who's TDJ again?
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:34 pm

@CT-1138 wrote:
Who's TDJ again?

The initials of Ty's real name.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:35 pm

@BarrytheOnyx wrote:
I am this close to signing off permanently.
Please don't
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:06 pm

I'm going to be honest, I haven't seen one person act like a "t.rex fanboy" over the spino vs rex fight since 2008. Spino4.4, you need to understand that this is the internet and people will act childish, there's no point stressing over it. The spino hate is nowhere near as strong as it was when JPL imitated the ban on the subject. Besides, the spino's inclusion or absence from the movie wasn't going to save it; JP3 was a disaster from the get-go and it's an example of what happens when you have a director who is trying to direct a movie without a solid script. Stanley Kubrick can pull it off because he is an exceptional director, Joe Johnston is not.

Almost everything was handled poorly in JP3 and there's blame to hand about to the entire film making crew and even Universal. If you wanted to find someone who deserves the most blame I'd have to say to look to Jack Horner; he truly does hate on the T.rex like some edgy hipster and created the toxic environment surrounding the spino in JP3.

The movie is firmly planted in the past and I don't think Universal is doing this consciously, it's probably someone from PR or the social media outlet who decided it might be a cool to make the spino skeleton in JW more than just an Easter Egg and make it an actual cameo. As someone who does hold some of the Masrani site and JP:TG as canon I would not say this is the case here. Media wise, I think Universal is staying far away from the Spino not because of "fanboys" but rather because JP3 is a blight in the JP series and they would rather not spend too much time there.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:16 am

@Megaspino2 wrote:
I'm going to be honest, I haven't seen one person act like a "t.rex fanboy" over the spino vs rex fight since 2008. Spino4.4, you need to understand that this is the internet and people will act childish, there's no point stressing over it. The spino hate is nowhere near as strong as it was when JPL imitated the ban on the subject. Besides, the spino's inclusion or absence from the movie wasn't going to save it; JP3 was a disaster from the get-go and it's an example of what happens when you have a director who is trying to direct a movie without a solid script. Stanley Kubrick can pull it off because he is an exceptional director, Joe Johnston is not.

Almost everything was handled poorly in JP3 and there's blame to hand about to the entire film making crew and even Universal. If you wanted to find someone who deserves the most blame I'd have to say to look to Jack Horner; he truly does hate on the T.rex like some edgy hipster and created the toxic environment surrounding the spino in JP3.

All of this. Spino 4.4, your anger towards the fans has reached such an extreme, that you have purposely overlooked the real culprit via Horner, and to a lesser extent, the producers since they basically let Horner do whatever he wanted.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:41 pm

I think some of you guys understood my posts wrong. I am not directing my anger towards anyone here, neither I am spewing slurs at anyone here or a JP fan. My anger isn't towards fans. 

I'm just ranting about some fanboys that piss me off, and this Universal act was the breaking point.

Just because some of you guys didn't see any T.rex fanboy talk trash about Spinosaurus doesn't mean they don't exist. I know they exist because as I said, I already saw this type of stuff. And that's what I mean, they are toxic and they helped too to make Spino a hated dinosaur. I mean, we all got over this fight, every mature fan did. But the immatures can't, so they still bring in.

I agree that I did over react with the slurs and negative talk, but I still have my opinion,  they are toxic and they have a lot of fault too.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:19 pm

I think I see where Spino is coming from. You can blame Horner and the producers all you want. 

But there are still tons of people who just never let it go(for too long). The amount of rage that a movie animal being killed, produced too extreme of a backlash imo. I respect people's right to hate the movie and hate the scene. But some people have acted like Universal came to their parents house and spit in their faces. 

Am I talking about people here? Of course not. But I still feel that there are people who held on to the grudge so hard to a ridiculous extent, for a crazy amount of time. 

Universal feeling the need to take the Spino off the cover of JP3 a decade after it happened, the Spino scene in JW and now them saying it's the same one from JP3 is proof of the continued outrage mentality to me. Or maybe it's just more dumb ass producers trying too hard and overcompensating? I think it's probably a bit of both. But again the fact they did these things didn't just drop out of the sky. 

I mean even the rage from some of the stuff in the Star Wars prequels hasn't reached this level has it? Where they have decided to change a cover of a movie based on one scene? Do the Star Wars prequels have a "forbidden topic" scene that induces intense arguments when people talk about it? I haven't seen it personally so correct me if I'm wrong. It's just crazy to me that this one scene is still cared about. 

Again I'm not blaming anyone here but I definitely see both sides to this. I'm trying to play devils advocate and try and say what Spino4.4 is trying to say(I think) in a more calm manner. 

But in all seriousness the fanbase should re direct rage at Dilo still only physically appearing in one film. Wink


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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:26 pm

This 100% ^.

Basically what I was trying to say, but it got overshadowned by my slurs and rage. Thanks Troyal1.  Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:49 pm

I truly and honestly dislike JW, and in my short stay here I've learned to hate it ever so more (that 5/10 rating I gave it on that pinned thread has lowered to either 4/10 or 3/10), HOWEVER I admit of being somewhat hyperbolic here at times in my arguments. Alright, quite a lot of times. There is some unfair rage in my words quite a few times, as well as bringing up stuff that isn't necessary. Even if they are my honest opinions, maybe I should restrain from saying them.

Having said that. Some of you guys effectively repeating on and on again, day and day after how Horner is this evil megalomaniac who single-handedly ruined everything in JP franchise, is just that. Hyperbolic. It's a surprise no-one yet posted a photoshopped image of Horner with black mustache, wine class and speech balloon where he is speaking about villainy things in French accent. Maybe at the same time tying dinosaurs on rail tracks with rope.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:10 pm

For my part, I find Horner's lack of professionalism within his position as paleontologist adviser extremely aggravating. Plus the fact that he seems to make more money as a dinosaur sensationalist celebrity and his "dino-chicken" reverse engineering chicken basically cheapens his position as a serious scientist in my eyes. With that said, I don't actively hate the guy, but I do consider him a "broken pedestal" figure, a man who was worthy of respect at one point for his theories and discoveries but has since contributed little positive in later years to either the science or the film franchise. I just wish he would stop being kept in an advisory position in the franchise, because it's not likely to improve on the accuracy front (now that would be saying something) in the next or even final film while he's still around.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:47 pm

There are several logical reasons for why the Spinosaurus ended up on Isla Nublar. The most likely reason is that InGen brought it over from Isla Sorna (potentially to be an attraction,) and ended up killing it (most likely due to it's aggression.) We already know that Jurassic World brought it's initial specimens over from Sorna, so why would it be unbelievable that they brought the Spinosaurus to Nublar at one point?
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:24 pm

Mistral wrote:
Having said that. Some of you guys effectively repeating on and on again, day and day after how Horner is this evil megalomaniac who single-handedly ruined everything in JP franchise, is just that. Hyperbolic. It's a surprise no-one yet posted a photoshopped image of Horner with black mustache, wine class and speech balloon where he is speaking about villainy things in French accent. Maybe at the same time tying dinosaurs on rail tracks with rope.

It's not that he's evil, but he is biased and that bias influenced JP3 in a way that didn't help the movie. Have a look, this is no witch hunt:



Start at 6:43 when Horner starts talking to 8:30. Notice how the actor of Billy says how Horner described the Spino to the actors and then pay attention to his description of the T.rex; the sentiment that the T.rex is old news and the Spino was the thing of the future is sprinkled throughout the entire video. This was not an attempt to replace the T.rex but rather to try and drive it into extinction (no pun intended) from the franchise. It's not wonder this movie left a poison root in the fan base. Like I said every one of those people are to blame for the mess JP3 was, but the most toxic elements that came out of it are from Horner and you can't deny that.

I do agree though there are some people who won't let go of it and those individuals really need to grow up. However, some people just want to get under other's skin and the internet gives them a perfect place to ply their "trolling trade".

The Beeg One: It's unbelievable because the spino skeleton from JW looks nothing like the one from JP3 and there are differences that can't just be overlooked.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:49 pm

I've gone over this before, but every film's goal so far has been to have bigger and betterer (yes that's a word now) theropod monster ploy. It's the ages old sequel cliche, do the same thing but bigger to "top it off". It's what the studio demands from writers and "consultants"

TLW) Now there's two T-Rexes, double the volume!!!
JP3) Spino biggest carnivore ever!!!!! Lol T-Rex, get the **** out
JW) I-Rex super smart hybrid monster Godzilla!!!! Lol Spinosaurus, get the **** out

And so their "consultant" recommended Spino, and the producers nodded because it was the bigger and betterer thing they wanted. Now what he may or may not have said... for year 2000 the Spino wasn't necessarily scientifically wrong, but even if he had personal bias and some sort of alterior motive... what does it matter? You think Trevorrow doesn't have bias? It's clear that guy doesn't care crap about TLW and JP3, and sees JP as the ultimate romantized childhood nostalgia fest. He may just be the puppet of the producers, but you think his bias didn't shine through JW?
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:20 pm

Mistral wrote:
Some of you guys effectively repeating on and on again, day and day after how Horner is this evil megalomaniac who single-handedly ruined everything in JP franchise, is just that. Hyperbolic. It's a surprise no-one yet posted a photoshopped image of Horner with black mustache, wine class and speech balloon where he is speaking about villainy things in French accent. Maybe at the same time tying dinosaurs on rail tracks with rope.

@BarrytheOnyx wrote:
For my part, I find Horner's lack of professionalism within his position as paleontologist adviser extremely aggravating. Plus the fact that he seems to make more money as a dinosaur sensationalist celebrity and his "dino-chicken" reverse engineering chicken basically cheapens his position as a serious scientist in my eyes. With that said, I don't actively hate the guy, but I do consider him a "broken pedestal" figure, a man who was worthy of respect at one point for his theories and discoveries but has since contributed little positive in later years to either the science or the film franchise. I just wish he would stop being kept in an advisory position in the franchise, because it's not likely to improve on the accuracy front (now that would be saying something) in the next or even final film while he's still around.

To further his point, I should list the amount of things Horner has done to irk dino-nerds and JP fans the wrong way.

1. Horner has believed that T. rex was able to kill some prey, but only the old and sick. Basically a weakling killer that preferred to scavenge. In fact up until JP3, he admitted in his book The Complete T. rex (techincally Don Lessem co-wrote it, but Horner wrote at least 85% of it so for for intents and purposes, it's his book) that his pure scavenger theory was BS.

"I actually don't truly believe that T-Rex was 100% a scavenger. However, sometimes, I like to bring it up just to see my colleagues argue."

There comes a time when getting people to talk about things becomes trolling and Horner has been a troll for sometime.

Also, he still believes his original mindset even though evidence via bite marks on hadrosaurs and Triceratops fossils that have semi-healed have proven that T. rex can catch full grown healthy dinosaurs and that it was mostly a hunter.

2. The fact that it took 20+ years for MOR-555, aka Wankel Rex to be described after it was dug up. Yes, you could argue that the first 10 years were due to hi working on the JP movies, but that doesn't explain the other years when JW was in developmental hell.

3. He may have botched the description of MOR-008.

4. Celeste, which is reported to be larger then Sue and was found under his watch, has yet to be described.

5. His theory that Torosaurus was a full grown male Triceratops. While their is far more remains of Torosaurus then there was-and even today still is-with Spinosaurus by the time that JP3 was made. The amount of Torosaurus fossils found so far have been very few when compared to that of Triceratops which a far, far ,far more numerous and also more complete. So on that fount, few people believe him.

6. When asked about how the raptors in JP3 look like he said 'Your guess is as good as mine.'

7. His multiple theories about bonehead dinosaurs: The the Pachycephalosaurus couldn't headbutt (proven wrong), that the dome supported a horn (proven wrong again) and the many boneheads represent Pachycephalosaurus in different stages of growth-which is at best inconclusive due to how rare bonehead dinosaurs are.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:16 pm

Mistral wrote:
I've gone over this before, but every film's goal so far has been to have bigger and betterer (yes that's a word now) theropod monster ploy. It's the ages old sequel cliche, do the same thing but bigger to "top it off". It's what the studio demands from writers and "consultants"

TLW) Now there's two T-Rexes, double the volume!!!
JP3) Spino biggest carnivore ever!!!!! Lol T-Rex, get the **** out
JW) I-Rex super smart hybrid monster Godzilla!!!! Lol Spinosaurus, get the **** out

And so their "consultant" recommended Spino, and the producers nodded because it was the bigger and betterer thing they wanted. Now what he may or may not have said... for year 2000 the Spino wasn't necessarily scientifically wrong, but even if he had personal bias and some sort of alterior motive... what does it matter? You think Trevorrow doesn't have bias? It's clear that guy doesn't care crap about TLW and JP3, and sees JP as the ultimate romantized childhood nostalgia fest. He may just be the puppet of the producers, but you think his bias didn't shine through JW?
Agree 100%

I always saw Horner pushing the Spino so much because the whole theme of JP3 was NEW. New danger. More danger. Evolving raptors, Pteranodons and then the Spino.  I see his statements as more marketing than science talk. Which is kinda understandable since he's involved in making a movie, and like you said they have been pushing for more and bigger since the beginning. I also see his raptors statement about the look of them, being more evidence of the studio wanting different just to be different. To me he's always been a salesman just as much a scientist.  

I don't understand why his trolling or being wrong matters really. I don't think the studio really cares about the science.  At the end of the day the studio wanted something different and they got it. If it hadn't been for the backlash the Indominus probably wouldn't have gotten beaten by the Rex.


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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:23 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@CT-1138 wrote:
Who's TDJ again?

The initials of Ty's real name.
Ohhh... right. Embarassed I was thinking it was one of the director/producers on the JP franchise. Yeah, I think we're all going to be considering this non-canon on a personal level. Myself included. It's become a lot like the TLW viral sites, which were there to promote JP: The Ride as much as TLW the movie. The viral site has certainly evolved into its own news source site, and the site was never very coherent with the movie in the first place, so I think its being on the same level as the films has been put into question.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:27 pm

@CT-1138 wrote:
@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@CT-1138 wrote:
Who's TDJ again?

The initials of Ty's real name.
Ohhh... right. Embarassed I was thinking it was one of the director/producers on the JP franchise. Yeah, I think we're all going to be considering this non-canon on a personal level. Myself included. It's become a lot like the TLW viral sites, which were there to promote JP: The Ride as much as TLW the movie. The viral site has certainly evolved into its own news source site, and the site was never very coherent with the movie in the first place, so I think its being on the same level as the films has been put into question.
There were TLW viral sites? I'm too young for that lol
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:29 pm

@Troyal1 wrote:
Mistral wrote:
I've gone over this before, but every film's goal so far has been to have bigger and betterer (yes that's a word now) theropod monster ploy. It's the ages old sequel cliche, do the same thing but bigger to "top it off". It's what the studio demands from writers and "consultants"

TLW) Now there's two T-Rexes, double the volume!!!
JP3) Spino biggest carnivore ever!!!!! Lol T-Rex, get the **** out
JW) I-Rex super smart hybrid monster Godzilla!!!! Lol Spinosaurus, get the **** out

And so their "consultant" recommended Spino, and the producers nodded because it was the bigger and betterer thing they wanted. Now what he may or may not have said... for year 2000 the Spino wasn't necessarily scientifically wrong, but even if he had personal bias and some sort of alterior motive... what does it matter? You think Trevorrow doesn't have bias? It's clear that guy doesn't care crap about TLW and JP3, and sees JP as the ultimate romantized childhood nostalgia fest. He may just be the puppet of the producers, but you think his bias didn't shine through JW?
Agree 100%

I always saw Horner pushing the Spino so much because the whole theme of JP3 was NEW. New danger. More danger. Evolving raptors, Pteranodons and then the Spino. I see his statements as more marketing than science talk. Which is kinda understandable since he's involved in making a movie, and like you said they have been pushing for more and bigger since the beginning. 

I don't understand why his trolling or being wrong matters really. I don't think the studio really cares about the science. At the end of the day the studio wanted something different and they got it. If it hadn't been for the backlash the Indominus probably wouldn't have gotten beaten by the Rex.

Because JP and TLW were the most accurate depictions of dinosaurs to be portrayed in dinosaur movies. Yes, there were a few slight changes, but the good via accuracy far outweighed the bad. JP and TLW demanded accuracy as much as possible back then. In fact, when JP hit the big screen, Horner was still respected at that time and he hadn't gone off into what he became now. It wasn't until JP3 did the solid standing of being accurate go downhill with JW going down even further. Please note that when Spielberg made those two movies, Horner's mindset didn't take hold, but in JP3 when Spielberg sat around and basically did nothing, Horner was allowed free reign by the producers. I suspect he was still allowed much of that since the basic accuracy-the Stegosaurus being tail draggers were as the ones in TLW had their tails held high like in real life-dropped even further.

If anything else, Horner wanted to let his real self show and given how lazy the producers were with giving him free reign, it clearly shows. If anything else, his lack of caring really shows.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue Apr 18, 2017 7:11 pm

I'm a follower of many franchises and I promise you, this is the least offensive extended canon element I've ever seen stir up controversy. Yes, it's stupid, but in the end it's completely ignorable. I wouldn't let a team of interns with stock footage and Sony Vegas tell me what's what.

Edit: Rhedosaurus, Horner was the one who revealed that he estimates Celeste to be 10% larger than Sue. If he were actively hiding fossils in order to make T. Rex look weaker, he probably wouldn't have said anything about Celeste. If I had to guess why she hasn't been described, it might be because Horner is selfish and is holding it off until he retires so he can go out with a bang and buffer his legacy.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:00 pm

Celeste actually has yet to be accurately described. In fact, I believe there's a number of T. rex specimens at the MOR that have yet to be described while Horner's off chasing chickensaurus. He's been sitting on them, making claims while basically doing nothing with them. Horner has had a vendetta with T. rex for a while now, and I have no idea why (though I think I remember Bakker cracking a joke about him not liking that T. rex predated on Maiasaura). He even wrote a very good book about T. rex that I own.


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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:07 pm

@BoulderFaceplant wrote:
Edit: Rhedosaurus, Horner was the one who revealed that he estimates Celeste to be 10% larger than Sue. If he were actively hiding fossils in order to make T. Rex look weaker, he probably wouldn't have said anything about Celeste. If I had to guess why she hasn't been described, it might be because Horner is selfish and is holding it off until he retires so he can go out with a bang and buffer his legacy.

@CT-1138 wrote:
Celeste actually has yet to be accurately described. In fact, I believe there's a number of T. rex specimens at the MOR that have yet to be described while Horner's off chasing chickensaurus. He's been sitting on them, making claims while basically doing nothing with them. Horner has had a vendetta with T. rex for a while now, and I have no idea why (though I think I remember Bakker cracking a joke about him not liking that T. rex predated on Maiasaura). He even wrote a very good read about T. rex that I own.

Actually, Horner retired from MOR last June. I don't doubt that he's sat on them for a long time. But now that he's gone, it's the responsibility of whoever is in charge of MOR now to get them described.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:11 pm

I heard he had retired from paleontology, didn't know that entailed the MOR too. Thank goodness. Now hopefully we'll get to see Celeste described properly.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:32 pm

@CT-1138 wrote:
I heard he had retired from paleontology, didn't know that entailed the MOR too. Thank goodness. Now hopefully we'll get to see Celeste described properly.

Not to mention, a possible re-dig to find more of her like BHI did with Duffy sometime in the 2000's. From what I've read, Celeste is only 10%-20% complete and that seems iffy to describe her with so little unless she had been found with a complete/mostly complete skull.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:31 pm

There's nothing wrong with accepting this as nothing more than an unsubstantiated rumor or comment made in jest taken too far. Trevorrow originally made the comment in jest I felt, but it others seem to interpret it as not a joke unfortunately. Honestly that's what I did with it myself for my own personal approach to putting down the misconceptions that rove about about the films and such. Why? Canonically it can be easily disproven by some quick deductive reasoning and logic work by looking at the JP3 size chart.. What it does is what Uni is good at when it comes to the JP canon and that's muddying the waters basically to prevent a clearer picture from forming. We may never know for sure, and that's okay. There's nothing wrong with the unknown or not having an answer.

As for my stance on the Masrani site, I can take it or leave it. It very probably will be retconned out at some point in the future if Uni needs to do that for the future films, stories, and so forth. We will have to once again adjust the encyclopedia to attempt to meet up with the official consensus of all things.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue May 02, 2017 3:19 pm

Some of you are definitely taking things too personal and are overthinking things that were done in the movies to justify your points.


As far as that tweet? Well it's just someone in charge of the social media account, it doesn't really mean much and social media managers actually have a lot of leeway so don't expect it to actually be canon. If the size is not right then you are overthinking this, there are plenty of mistakes like that in all JP films if you're going to measure every different shot and make sure it matches. I would consider the viral marketing websites a little more canon than the social media but that's about it. I think until proven wrong they can be considered canon but I doubt the directors of JP5 or 6 will take it into account when making the movies. If the Spino is the same one from JP/// I think that's cool but I don't mind it.

I do think you guys are overthinking the whole spinosaurus thing, it was clearly meant as a nod to fans who were upset, nothing more. If they didn't care they wouldn't have put it there and there'll never be a Rex v Spino round 2, this is the closest thing so yeah take it for what you will. I still don't understand why people are so upset that it happened in JP///, was it a cheap trick to show off the "Big bad" of that movie? of course but that's it.


Now I don't think they "hate" the sequels, but this was meant to be sort of a re-introduction to the series, after all it had been over a decade since the last film and they weren't going to inundate newcomers with lengthy explanations of  what had happened. That's why we got the viral websites explaining it for those of use (the fandom) that want those explanations. Before the movie i thought JW might've wanted to be a reboot that ignored TLW and JP/// but I don't think that anymore, but if it is we'll know soon enough with JW2 if Malcolm's dialog negates the prior two sequels but that's highly unlikely. I do think they could've had a single line of dialog in the movie that just mentioned "the sorna incident" and it wouldn't have caused much trouble or required more explanation than that, really just an easter eggs for fans but they didn't. I think with Malcolm in JW2 they'll definitely acknowledge the Sorna incident(s) unless it's a reboot which I mentioned it's not going to happen.
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PostSubject: Re: Universal's attempt to make the JW Spino skeleton that of the JP3 Spino.   Tue May 02, 2017 3:26 pm

@sdp wrote:
Some of you are definitely taking things too personal and are overthinking things that were done in the movies to justify your points.

In hindsight, you're probably correct. But considering how Universal has seemed to learn the wrong lessons with the first two sequels, not to mention how they don't care about the canon, it's not hard to think that they would actually endorse this.
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