T Rex Spinosaurus rematch in Jurassic World 2 petition noted by Colin Trevorrow.

CT-1138 wrote:

Mistral wrote:

Do they still have the old Spino animatronic somewhere? You know, collecting dust in Winston's family warehouse or something?

Probably not. And even if they did, it probably would be all messed up, and make the old frankenstein-ish JP3 Rex animatronic look baby smooth in comparison. The skin, it really doesn't age well with these things.

No, it was dismantled and key parts (claws, head and neck section, teeth) were sold off at auction.

That's too bad.

I presume that's happened to all of the animatronics of the first three films?

Mistral wrote:

CT-1138 wrote:

Mistral wrote:

Do they still have the old Spino animatronic somewhere? You know, collecting dust in Winston's family warehouse or something?

Probably not. And even if they did, it probably would be all messed up, and make the old frankenstein-ish JP3 Rex animatronic look baby smooth in comparison. The skin, it really doesn't age well with these things.

No, it was dismantled and key parts (claws, head and neck section, teeth) were sold off at auction.

That's too bad.

I presume that's happened to all of the animatronics of the first three films?

I believe so, yes.

TyrannoFan wrote:

When I was younger and watched JP3 for the first time I was shocked and felt betrayed by the utter destruction of the T. rex. I spent countless hours surfing the internet looking for arguments to confirm my idea that the T. rex should have won over that silly stupid crocodile rip-off with a sail.

But nowadays I want them to do a rematch and still have the Spino win so I can witness the salt mining industry boom.

In all seriousness, a T. rex vs Spinosaurus rematch would just be a bit too forced and fanservicey for me. However, I would actually like to see Spino again. I really like him nowadays.

That's what I would do if I was a director. 

And if people cried, I would tell them to deal with it or I would make a compilation of dinosaurs killing T.rex. 

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

That's what I would do if I was a director. 

And if people cried, I would tell them to deal with it or I would make a compilation of dinosaurs killing T.rex. 

Yeah, but with you it wouldn't be done ironically

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

That's what I would do if I was a director. 

And if people cried, I would tell them to deal with it or I would make a compilation of dinosaurs killing T.rex. 

Yeah, but with you it wouldn't be done ironically

Actually it would, I'm just kidding. 

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

That's what I would do if I was a director. 

And if people cried, I would tell them to deal with it or I would make a compilation of dinosaurs killing T.rex. 

Yeah, but with you it wouldn't be done ironically

Actually it would, I'm just kidding. 

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Troyal1 wrote:

Mistral wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

In fact it was one of those youtubers who noticed that on the set picture of the museum. There appears to be (what seems to be) both a T Rex and a Spinosaurus animatronic standing together on set reflected on the glass.

What?

 He's talking about this. Although I see no Spino, there is a Rex in the background. https://twitter.com/ledoctor/status/855435692289040394

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFxQdNtMH88

Minute 4:20

I really don't think that the other reflected image looks like much of anything.

 And even if it is it means nothing. Since we know that everything in that photo is

Spoiler:

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

That's what I would do if I was a director. 

And if people cried, I would tell them to deal with it or I would make a compilation of dinosaurs killing T.rex. 

Yeah, but with you it wouldn't be done ironically

Actually it would, I'm just kidding. 

I'm glad we are cool. 

I would love to see the Spinosaurus return, but I'd rather not have a Rex/Spino rematch. It's been pretty drawn out War between the fans of both animals and it would be best not to add fuel to the fire. I'd rather something that more interesting. Like the long awaited battle between T. Rex and Triceratops or have a pair of Carnotaurs take on Rexy.

Unfortunately, I don't think the Spinosaurus is ever going to appear in the franchise again. The "scene that shall not be named" just had too jarring an effect on people, and Universal, being the cowardly kittens that they are, probably don't ever even want to reference anything to do with JP3 or that scene in particular.

And it's a damn shame, as the Spinosaurus was truly an amazing animal, especially considering recent discoveries. Me and Rhedo were talking about a Rex potentially being partially nocturnal and having a third eyelid like crocodiles, and I think these ideas could easily be transferred over to a more scientifically accurate, sea serpent-ish version of the Spinosaurus for a future film. Could make for a truly terrifying scene.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Six-Foot Turkey wrote:

I too didn't really like how the T-rex went out in JP3, however, I just don't like the idea of a rematch at all. There's no scenario that I can think of where a rematch wouldn't feel forced and unnecessary. I honestly don't think we'll ever see the Spinosaurus again in the series either. In my opinion, no, I really don't want to see a rematch, I'd rather the focus be on other things: expanding the lore, characters, new Dinosaurs, inGen and Biosyn etc. If we dwell too much on a rematch of a Dino fight that happened all the way back in part 3, we're not really focussing on progression.

Keep in mind that if a rematch were to happen it would only be one scene that will probably not even me a minute long.

So even with a 1 minute rematch, it is a 2 hour long film so there is still plenty of room for everything else (Story, characters, bringing in new things, having other dinos shine and all that).

There are some scenarios in wich a rematch could work within the story. One is millionaires owning both a Rex and a Spino and having them fight in order to have bets (Similar to what happens in real life with dog fights and rooster fights). That way it can also fit within the man playing with nature theme of the series.

But then we have to ask ourselves if it's even worth throwing it in there for a couple of minutes if it adds nothing to the story. I think your idea of having them being forced to fight like people do with dogs is a good idea. How it'll look on-screen, I'm not so sure.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Troyal1 wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Six-Foot Turkey wrote:

I too didn't really like how the T-rex went out in JP3, however, I just don't like the idea of a rematch at all. There's no scenario that I can think of where a rematch wouldn't feel forced and unnecessary. I honestly don't think we'll ever see the Spinosaurus again in the series either. In my opinion, no, I really don't want to see a rematch, I'd rather the focus be on other things: expanding the lore, characters, new Dinosaurs, inGen and Biosyn etc. If we dwell too much on a rematch of a Dino fight that happened all the way back in part 3, we're not really focussing on progression.

Keep in mind that if a rematch were to happen it would only be one scene that will probably not even me a minute long.

So even with a 1 minute rematch, it is a 2 hour long film so there is still plenty of room for everything else (Story, characters, bringing in new things, having other dinos shine and all that).

There are some scenarios in wich a rematch could work within the story. One is millionaires owning both a Rex and a Spino and having them fight in order to have bets (Similar to what happens in real life with dog fights and rooster fights). That way it can also fit within the man playing with nature theme of the series.

I'm sorry but that sounds awful and hard to believe. Two millionaires using these crazy rare animals brought back from the dead to fight. All so rex can win? 

How can this fit in the story without feeling like complete fan service.

Well it is a franchise about millionaires bringing extinct animals from the dead while mixing them up with a bit of DNA of frogs in order to make a dinosaur theme park and throw some other mutants mixed with many species DNA so one idea is not that far from the other.

The other options are an opening scene on Isla Sorna where both fight. It is not that unrealistic since both predators live on a small island so it would not be that unrealistic to have them running into each other often. We see in nature lions and hyenas often fighting each other to death.

The other option is that both are brought into the mainland and when all hell breaks lose (like in all JP films) they fight. Yes I do agree that it is fan service but...

When you think about it, Jurassic World had a lot of fan service and most people loved the fan service.

A personal opinion? (And this is just a personal speculation). This reminds me of when Jurassic World was first announced...Plenty of fans were very concerned at the simple thought of a sequel focusing on a mutant dinosaur rather than a real one and I also remember fans really hating the idea of the raptors being able to work with the protagonists because it took away the lethal suspense element from them. But at the end of the day, most fans were at the very least able to accept both ideas when they actually saw them within the film.

I think that exact same thing is going to happen if a rematch does happen. Right now I understand the worries because we have not seen it within the context of the movie. But if it does happen I am confident that it won´t be anywhere near as overly absurd as some worry that it will be.

Not gonna lie, when I saw people predicting that the Indominus Rex was communicating with the Raptors before the movie came out I thought that sounded incredibly awful. I was sure it wasn't going to happen. When it happened, it was pulled of quite well.

Also, T-rex vs Spinosaurus sounds like a big thing. A big, main set-piece. It wouldn't really suit being relegated to being a small cameo.

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

Unfortunately, I don't think the Spinosaurus is ever going to appear in the franchise again. The "scene that shall not be named" just had too jarring an effect on people, and Universal, being the cowardly kittens that they are, probably don't ever even want to reference anything to do with JP3 or that scene in particular.

And it's a damn shame, as the Spinosaurus was truly an amazing animal, especially considering recent discoveries. Me and Rhedo were talking about a Rex potentially being partially nocturnal and having a third eyelid like crocodiles, and I think these ideas could easily be transferred over to a more scientifically accurate, sea serpent-ish version of the Spinosaurus for a future film. Could make for a truly terrifying scene.  

I disagree with the notion that Universal is terrified to bring back the Spinosaurus for the sequel.

After all, the Spinosaurus is still featured in a lot of Jurassic Park related merchandise post JP3.

It appeared on the game Operation Genesis (2 years after JP3), It has appeared on most toylines from 2002 to 2015, It appeared in the IDW comics of 2012, and it appeared on most Jurassic World related videogames like the Lego Game and the Arcade game.

So I just can´t buy the idea that Universal wants to avoid it at all cost.

Having it return for a rematch in the sequel with a T Rex winning is not that much of a huge risk when you take into account that the amount of people in both the hardcore fans and general public that prefer the T Rex to the Spinosaurus is much much bigger than those who prefer the Spinosaurus. T Rexes are recognized as the icons of the franchise, while the Spinosaurus is remembered by most casual fans as just that dino that killed a T Rex. And although the Spinosaurus has fans, they are a very small minority when compared to the people who prefer the T Rex (both casual and hardcore fans combined).

So literally the worst thing that could happen if a rematch were to happen is that there could be arguments on the comments section of YouTube videos. I doubt that it will be the same amount of backlash that happened in the first time since last time it was a new dinosaur humilliating the icon of the franchise, while this time it would be the icon of the franchise winning against a dinosaur considered infamous by many.

If anything the rematch is a bonus for the marketing of the movie, because it is a topic that gets everyone talking. They may love or hate the idea, but everyone will talk about it for sure.

Quote :

And although the Spinosaurus has fans, they are a very small minority when compared to the people who prefer the T Rex (both casual and hardcore fans combined).

Because T.rex is a mainstream dinosaur that got a lot of marketing/fame on it's back. Everyone knows it, you don't need to be a dinosaur nut to know it. And in fact, that doesn't mean we can throw away Spinosaurus just bc Spino fans are minority.

That's not how the world works.

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Quote :

And although the Spinosaurus has fans, they are a very small minority when compared to the people who prefer the T Rex (both casual and hardcore fans combined).

Because T.rex is a mainstream dinosaur that got a lot of marketing/fame on it's back. Everyone knows it, you don't need to be a dinosaur nut to know it. And in fact, that doesn't mean we can throw away Spinosaurus just bc Spino fans are minority.

That's not how the world works.

Well the same film franchise that helped in giving the T Rex worldwide popularity was the same franchise that decided that it was a good idea to now have the loved T Rex turned into nothing more than easy opponent for the Spinosaurus despite being fully aware that everyone loves the T Rex for it´s power as top predator status.

Also keep in mind that we are not asking for the Spinosaurus species to be removed from anything JP related, neither are we doing this with the intention of making Spino fans feel bad. What we are asking for is for the sequel to show a T Rex taking down a Spinosaurus in order to cancel what JP3 established within the film canon, wich is that the Spinosaurus species is much superior in every way to the T Rex species.

We are not saying establish the Spino species as wimps either. We are simply saying, establish that they will not always humilliate T Rexes with such ease.

Because think about it, the entire marketing of JP3 centered around that idea, that T Rexes can not even dream of standing a chance against the Spino. The movie itself shows a T Rex giving it all against a Spinosaurus and the Spinosaurus walks out without a scratch while the Spino is able to break the neck of an adult T Rex in 2 seconds. That on top of the scene where Eric implies that Spinosaurus love to chase T Rexes whenever they smell them. So it is not as simple as just one fight.

I have to ask: why does this matter so much? I'm not trying to belittle your opinion or anything, but I feel like the T. Rex already has redemption enough. It destroyed the Spino skeleton, and it eventually defeated the Indominus, a literal genetic monster. Yes, it did have some help, but Rexy was old, and it wasn't like the Spino taking down a juvenile Rex basically coming into it's prime. I think the Rex ha spretty well been redeemed, and even saying "Well it'd take a couple minutes out of a two hour+ film", I think it'd still potentially break the flow of things or come off as just a little too much pandering.

^ Agree 100%.

I really think a combination of time and the respect and reverence the animal was treated with (as well as the little bit of fan service by having Rexy smash the Spino skeleton) in Jurassic World was more than enough to heal any wounds that the treatment of the Rex in JP3 caused.

To be perfectly honest, if somebody still needs more, considering the time that's passed and the mending of fences that JW tried to do, I'd say that's more an issue with that particular viewer than anything.

TheDreamMaster wrote:

I have to ask: why does this matter so much? I'm not trying to belittle your opinion or anything, but I feel like the T. Rex already has redemption enough. It destroyed the Spino skeleton, and it eventually defeated the Indominus, a literal genetic monster. Yes, it did have some help, but Rexy was old, and it wasn't like the Spino taking down a juvenile Rex basically coming into it's prime. I think the Rex ha spretty well been redeemed, and even saying "Well it'd take a couple minutes out of a two hour+ film", I think it'd still potentially break the flow of things or come off as just a little too much pandering.

No worries, it is a very valid question. It matters because for many fans Jurassic Park and The Lost World are their favorite films and most nostalgic memory of their childhood and to many the Jurassic film canon equals the T Rex being the glorious top predator.

If what they love about the series is that, then you can not expect them to like the establishment that within the films the Spinosauruses now dominate the T Rexes like nothing.

If the main issue here is trying to re establish that Spinosauruses will not always humilliate T Rexes in a few seconds then bringing back an old T Rex to smash a skeleton, and to get knocked out in seconds against Indominus does not help the cause. If anything it continues to show that within the movies T Rexes have trouble fighting other giant therapods.

So that is the central thing here, what´s in question when we talk about redemption for the T Rex is not if it can have a semi heroic role or to showcase it´s popularity, but rather re establishing within the movies that they can take down a Spinosaurus in order to cancel what JP3 established wich is that they stand no chance.

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

^ Agree 100%.

I really think a combination of time and the respect and reverence the animal was treated with (as well as the little bit of fan service by having Rexy smash the Spino skeleton) in Jurassic World was more than enough to heal any wounds that the treatment of the Rex in JP3 caused.

To be perfectly honest, if somebody still needs more, considering the time that's passed and the mending of fences that JW tried to do, I'd say that's more an issue with that particular viewer than anything.

If the wound is the establishment that JP3 established that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos then a skeleton smash does not exactly treat that wound. It is nothing more than a symbolic nod. The producers telling us they know they did something wrong, but it did not quite correct the problem, it only mentioned it.

About this being something more about the individual and ... Again I bring back my example about the Star Wars prequels. They were released 18 years ago and yet to this day there are still plenty of Star Wars fans who have enormous amounts of deep hatred for them. And those are adults who range from 20 year olds to 40 year olds.

But who am I to tell them they can not feel that way if they honestly really hated them?

Sometimes people just really hate something regardless of how much time has passed. Again I bring back my example of the song, if a song was released in 2001 and a person really hates it they are not going to all of the sudden love the song just because 16 years have passed since it was released.

And these types of things happen more often than people think, there was a petition right after The Force Awakens was released to bring back Han Solo from the dead. There was another petition to bring back the Expanded Universe of Star Wars since it was declared non canon in 2014. But can not just dismiss them all as inmature people who are not able to get over things. Instead what I do is put myself in their shoes.

Maybe to me Han Solo was not my favorite character but to them it was their idol. So they never wanted him to go out like that. Maybe I never read the expanded universe but to other fans it was their Star Wars canon for 20 plus years. So it is hard do all of the sudden accept that it does not longer matter.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

If the wound is the establishment that JP3 established that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos then a skeleton smash does not exactly treat that wound. It is nothing more than a symbolic nod. The producers telling us they know they did something wrong, but it did not quite correct the problem, it only mentioned it.

Firstly, one fight scene between one random Spinosaurus and one random Tyrannosaurus doesn't dictate that all "T. rexes stand no chance against Spinos". Only that in that one particular instance the Spinosaur got the upper hand. Secondly, the filmmakers of JW acknowledged the "mistake". Why is that not enough? Considering that, as I said before, it was a one-off fight, there is no "problem" to correct. There is no set standard. Only a one-off situation in which countless variables could have contributed to the outcome of the fight.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

About this being something more about the individual and ... Again I bring back my example about the Star Wars prequels. They were released 18 years ago and yet to this day there are still plenty of Star Wars fans who have enormous amounts of deep hatred for them. And those are adults who range from 20 year olds to 40 year olds.

But who am I to tell them they can not feel that way if they honestly really hated them?

Sometimes people just really hate something regardless of how much time has passed. Again I bring back my example of the song, if a song was released in 2001 and a person really hates it they are not going to all of the sudden love the song just because 16 years have passed since it was released.

You're free to hate whatever you want, as is everybody. Your opinion is your own. What you're suggesting goes beyond that. You are suggesting that you need physical appeasement from the filmmakers.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

And these types of things happen more often than people think, there was a petition right after The Force Awakens was released to bring back Han Solo from the dead. There was another petition to bring back the Expanded Universe of Star Wars since it was declared non canon in 2014. But can not just dismiss them all as inmature people who are not able to get over things.Instead what I do is put myself in their shoes.

Ok. Put yourself in the shoes of a Spinosaurus fan that doesn't want to see their favorite dinosaur get demolished by a far more popular dinosaur. You're basically implying that their opinions and feelings on the subject are irrelevant because they're in the minority.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Maybe to me Han Solo was not my favorite character but to them it was their idol. So they never wanted him to go out like that. Maybe I never read the expanded universe but to other fans it was their Star Wars canon for 20 plus years. So it is hard do all of the sudden accept that it does not longer matter.

The parallels you're trying to make don't work. What you're suggesting would mean that a Spinosaurus would have to be taken down on screen, which fans of the animal obviously wouldn't care for. Why are their feelings irrelevant? Because they're in the minority?

You're basically suggesting that two wrongs make a right.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

TheDreamMaster wrote:

I have to ask: why does this matter so much? I'm not trying to belittle your opinion or anything, but I feel like the T. Rex already has redemption enough. It destroyed the Spino skeleton, and it eventually defeated the Indominus, a literal genetic monster. Yes, it did have some help, but Rexy was old, and it wasn't like the Spino taking down a juvenile Rex basically coming into it's prime. I think the Rex ha spretty well been redeemed, and even saying "Well it'd take a couple minutes out of a two hour+ film", I think it'd still potentially break the flow of things or come off as just a little too much pandering.

No worries, it is a very valid question. It matters because for many fans Jurassic Park and The Lost World are their favorite films and most nostalgic memory of their childhood  and to many the Jurassic film canon equals the T Rex being the glorious top predator.

If what they love about the series is that, then you can not expect them to like the establishment that within the films the Spinosauruses now dominate the T Rexes like nothing.

If the main issue here is trying to re establish that Spinosauruses will not always humilliate T Rexes in a few seconds then bringing back an old T Rex to smash a skeleton, and to get knocked out in seconds against Indominus does not help the cause. If anything it continues to show that within the movies T Rexes have trouble fighting other giant therapods.

So that is the central thing here, what´s in question when we talk about redemption for the T Rex is not if it can have a semi heroic role or to showcase it´s popularity, but rather re establishing within the movies that they can take down a Spinosaurus in order to cancel what JP3 established wich is that they stand no chance.

I understand what you're trying to say. But my view is that you're treating the Trex too much like Batman and not enough like an animal. Like if Batman was killed by the joker I could understand people being angry. But we are talking about real animals here. Just because the Trex is a dominant predator doesn't mean it can't lose. 

And before you say the Spino is not scientifically accurate 2 things. 

1. There are other things in Jurassic park films that aren't scientifically accurate.

2. There are animals in real life that could have killed or injured a real Trex badly when it existed. 

They wanted a monster for their 3rd movie. Was it done poorly, by most opinions yes. But I really don't think there is this HUGE base of people out there clamoring for another fight. If anything I see a fight making the fan base possibly hate each other and argue even more.

Here's the thing, there is no precedent canon wise or franchise wise that says T.rex will always loose to Spinosaurs or for that matter any other super predator. Franchise wise JP3 was a product of the filmmakers wanting to do their own thing with the JP series. The rex was the icon of Spielberg's first two Jurassic Park movies and Johnston wanted something of his own. Horner was called in and suggested spino as the new icon of their movie. There was nothing wrong with the idea but the execution is where things go wrong. I think they got all caught up in trying to make the spino look as ferocious and awesome as possible that they never stopped to question anything they were writing. It was a huge blunder and a stain on the franchise and Universal understands that. Notice how quickly the spino logo was taken off JP merchandise and replaced with the rex? Sure it's on the JP3 stuff but anything after that either features just the rex or the rex and spino together. JPOG which was released just a few years after JP3 has the rex back on the logo. Furthermore, if you check out the new Blu Ray releases for JP3 you will notice that the rex is on the cover in the style of the older movies. That means that despite the filmmakers doing their best (or worst) to try and replace the rex, it has endured meaning Universal has no intention of taking that one fight as canon moving forward. We can look at it as an "Oops" moment.

Canon wise there are a plethora of reasons that can explain why that particular rex lost to that spino. Many believe it was a sub adult and judging by the size chart that would be the most correct; others like to think it was the rex from TLW and the leg never healed or that particular rex was just not experienced in combat. Again it was one fight, it's not like we saw the spino slaughter 4 other rex in the course of the movie. For example, a lion is killed by a Cape Buffalo and applying that logic you might say "hm, I guess all lions will always get killed by buffalo." However, that is far from the truth, in reality lions hunt these buffalo and while the buffalo can kill lions, lions can also kill them.

And just because the JP rex got tossed around by the I.rex it doesn't mean the rex is inferior. The I.rex is supposed to be a genetic monster, having DNA of raptors, giganotosaur, t.rex and many other creatures. If the rex killed the I.rex easily plot wise there would be no tension, no action. It would just be over in a few seconds perhaps less than a minute and wait, doesn't that sound familiar?

Point is there is no basis for any kind of precedent. There was a fight in JP3, it was a one off scene that was poorly thought out, poorly executed and Universal has no intentions to revisit that. Having another fight is not going to make things any better and it is certainly not going to fix JP3. I personally don't think that many people are still sore over it, however if they are then they are. These people shouldn't get their hopes up though since it is clear that Universal has no intention of taking this any further than the spino skeleton reference in JW.

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

If the wound is the establishment that JP3 established that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos then a skeleton smash does not exactly treat that wound. It is nothing more than a symbolic nod. The producers telling us they know they did something wrong, but it did not quite correct the problem, it only mentioned it.

Firstly, one fight scene between one random Spinosaurus and one random Tyrannosaurus doesn't dictate that all "T. rexes stand no chance against Spinos". Only that in that one particular instance the Spinosaur got the upper hand. Secondly, the filmmakers of JW acknowledged the "mistake". Why is that not enough? Considering that, as I said before, it was a one-off fight, there is no "problem" to correct. There is no set standard. Only a one-off situation in which countless variables could have contributed to the outcome of the fight.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

About this being something more about the individual and ... Again I bring back my example about the Star Wars prequels. They were released 18 years ago and yet to this day there are still plenty of Star Wars fans who have enormous amounts of deep hatred for them. And those are adults who range from 20 year olds to 40 year olds.

But who am I to tell them they can not feel that way if they honestly really hated them?

Sometimes people just really hate something regardless of how much time has passed. Again I bring back my example of the song, if a song was released in 2001 and a person really hates it they are not going to all of the sudden love the song just because 16 years have passed since it was released.

You're free to hate whatever you want, as is everybody. Your opinion is your own. What you're suggesting goes beyond that. You are suggesting that you need physical appeasement from the filmmakers.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

And these types of things happen more often than people think, there was a petition right after The Force Awakens was released to bring back Han Solo from the dead. There was another petition to bring back the Expanded Universe of Star Wars since it was declared non canon in 2014. But can not just dismiss them all as inmature people who are not able to get over things.Instead what I do is put myself in their shoes.

Ok. Put yourself in the shoes of a Spinosaurus fan that doesn't want to see their favorite dinosaur get demolished by a far more popular dinosaur. You're basically implying that their opinions and feelings on the subject are irrelevant because they're in the minority.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Maybe to me Han Solo was not my favorite character but to them it was their idol. So they never wanted him to go out like that. Maybe I never read the expanded universe but to other fans it was their Star Wars canon for 20 plus years. So it is hard do all of the sudden accept that it does not longer matter.

The parallels you're trying to make don't work. What you're suggesting would mean that a Spinosaurus would have to be taken down on screen, which fans of the animal obviously wouldn't care for. Why are their feelings irrelevant? Because they're in the minority?

You're basically suggesting that two wrongs make a right.

The thing is, it is not just one fight. If you look at the making of JP3 featurette on the DVD you will see that Jack Horner, Joe Johnston, Stan Winston and the rest of the cast and crew´s intention was clear, make it clear that the T Rex species overal has no chance against a Spinosaurus, they literaly say that straight up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EohRO9rAufA&t=168s

They never say that they just wanted to have a Spino win a fight, Jack Horner literaly says that they wanted to establish the Spinosaurus is the hunter that hunts T Rexes. That in addition to what happens within the movie in the scene where Eric tells Grant that the Spinosaurus loves to go after T Rexes whenever they smell their urine.

So they did set a standard. They imply that within the Jurassic film canon Spinosauruses are the superior animal. It is not just the fight. In fact it is because of all of this that many casual fans still believe that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos.

Remember, just because something is not an issue to you, does not mean it is not an issue for others. Not everyone feels the same about something.

And I never said that Spinosaurus fans don´t matter. What I am saying is that most of them at the very least understand the why behind the rematch. They know the Spino is not the icon of the franchise, they are fully aware that the T Rex is one of the biggest reasons why the first 2 films are so important to longtime fans. So many of them would not be so shocked or devastated if a rematch were to happen. That is what I am saying.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

The thing is, it is not just one fight. If you look at the making of JP3 featurette on the DVD you will see that Jack Horner, Joe Johnston, Stan Winston and the rest of the cast and crew´s intention was clear, make it clear that the T Rex species overal has no chance against a Spinosaurus, they literaly say that straight up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EohRO9rAufA&t=168s

They never say that they just wanted to have a Spino win a fight, Jack Horner literaly says that they wanted to establish the Spinosaurus is the hunter that hunts T Rexes. That in addition to what happens within the movie in the scene where Eric tells Grant that the Spinosaurus loves to go after T Rexes whenever they smell their urine.

So they did set a standard. They imply that within the Jurassic film canon Spinosauruses are the superior animal. It is not just the fight. In fact it is because of all of this that many casual fans still believe that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos.

You're bringing up examples out of universe, using behind the scenes footage/interviews and implied intention to fit your narrative. By using that logic, I can now use the implied intention from JW (Rex smashing the Spino skeleton) as proof that the film makers are saying the Rex is the "superior animal". It goes both ways.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Remember, just because something is not an issue to you, does not mean it is not an issue for others. Not everyone feels the same about something.

And I never said that Spinosaurus fans don´t matter. What I am saying is that most of them at the very least understand the why behind the rematch. They know the Spino is not the icon of the franchise, they are fully aware that the T Rex is one of the biggest reasons why the first 2 films are so important to longtime fans. So many of them would not be so shocked or devastated if a rematch were to happen. That is what I am saying.

You just contradicted yourself here. With your first statement, you state that just because I feel a certain way doesn't mean others feel the same, which is fair. However, in the next statement, you pigeonholed "Spino fans" by saying that most of them "understand'.

Just because you think they do (or at least should) feel a certain way doesn't mean they do.

Troyal1 wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

TheDreamMaster wrote:

I have to ask: why does this matter so much? I'm not trying to belittle your opinion or anything, but I feel like the T. Rex already has redemption enough. It destroyed the Spino skeleton, and it eventually defeated the Indominus, a literal genetic monster. Yes, it did have some help, but Rexy was old, and it wasn't like the Spino taking down a juvenile Rex basically coming into it's prime. I think the Rex ha spretty well been redeemed, and even saying "Well it'd take a couple minutes out of a two hour+ film", I think it'd still potentially break the flow of things or come off as just a little too much pandering.

No worries, it is a very valid question. It matters because for many fans Jurassic Park and The Lost World are their favorite films and most nostalgic memory of their childhood  and to many the Jurassic film canon equals the T Rex being the glorious top predator.

If what they love about the series is that, then you can not expect them to like the establishment that within the films the Spinosauruses now dominate the T Rexes like nothing.

If the main issue here is trying to re establish that Spinosauruses will not always humilliate T Rexes in a few seconds then bringing back an old T Rex to smash a skeleton, and to get knocked out in seconds against Indominus does not help the cause. If anything it continues to show that within the movies T Rexes have trouble fighting other giant therapods.

So that is the central thing here, what´s in question when we talk about redemption for the T Rex is not if it can have a semi heroic role or to showcase it´s popularity, but rather re establishing within the movies that they can take down a Spinosaurus in order to cancel what JP3 established wich is that they stand no chance.

I understand what you're trying to say. But my view is that you're treating the Trex too much like Batman and not enough like an animal. Like if Batman was killed by the joker I could understand people being angry. But we are talking about real animals here. Just because the Trex is a dominant predator doesn't mean it can't lose. 

And before you say the Spino is not scientifically accurate 2 things. 

1. There are other things in Jurassic park films that aren't scientifically accurate.

2. There are animals in real life that could have killed or injured a real Trex badly when it existed. 

They wanted a monster for their 3rd movie. Was it done poorly, by most opinions yes. But I really don't think there is this HUGE base of people out there clamoring for another fight. If anything I see a fight making the fan base possibly hate each other and argue even more.

You are right that the T Rex is just an animal, and it can lose. But the problem is not that it can lose but rather that the series implied that this other species will dominate them with ease. Like of course a Lion can lose a fight but what they did is not that, what they did is more like trying to portray as if the Spinosaurus is the mongoose to the T Rex being the snake.

About how many people want the rematch, while I do recognize that there are fans who dont really care for a rematch, I also have to point out that there are more fans than people think that would like to see this (both casual and hardcore). The exact number I can not give you because one would have to do a poll on each and every single one of the millions of JP fans but I can provide some evidence that shows that the interest in a rematch is still high even after 16 years later (that alone tells you how big it is).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U01v3kg8HLQ&t=292s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgPuo7lNTEc

http://www.jurassicworld2movie.com/news/colin-trevorrow-teases-possible-t-rex-vs-spinosaurus-re-match-in-jurassic-world-2

https://www.christiantoday.com/article/jurassic.world.2.news.t.rex.and.spinosaurus.rematch.to.happen/75482.htm

http://www.latinoshealth.com/articles/14941/20160105/jurassic-world-2-cast-toys-plot-will-bring-original-characters.htm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4avls83GYOA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wc3kdWUQfkg

https://www.movienewsguide.com/jurassic-world-2-spoilers-possibility-rematch-t-rex-spinosaurus/139739

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lncyd1Kl1EA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzSIgIDCUHg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Jtv03M7zzY

https://www.instagram.com/p/BHuYoeigLt1Fw49r4pbhOqifUBNohNHj5T4LMM0/

http://www.imgrum.org/media/1151897232915827378_1641813329

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2w1dtxJ0Bc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFxQdNtMH88

it is because we knew there was still plenty of support that we decided to do the petition.

Tyrant Lizard wrote:

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

The thing is, it is not just one fight. If you look at the making of JP3 featurette on the DVD you will see that Jack Horner, Joe Johnston, Stan Winston and the rest of the cast and crew´s intention was clear, make it clear that the T Rex species overal has no chance against a Spinosaurus, they literaly say that straight up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EohRO9rAufA&t=168s

They never say that they just wanted to have a Spino win a fight, Jack Horner literaly says that they wanted to establish the Spinosaurus is the hunter that hunts T Rexes. That in addition to what happens within the movie in the scene where Eric tells Grant that the Spinosaurus loves to go after T Rexes whenever they smell their urine.

So they did set a standard. They imply that within the Jurassic film canon Spinosauruses are the superior animal. It is not just the fight. In fact it is because of all of this that many casual fans still believe that T Rexes stand no chance against Spinos.

You're bringing up examples out of universe, using behind the scenes footage/interviews and implied intention to fit your narrative. By using that logic, I can now use the implied intention from JW (Rex smashing the Spino skeleton) as proof that the film makers are saying the Rex is the "superior animal". It goes both ways.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

Remember, just because something is not an issue to you, does not mean it is not an issue for others. Not everyone feels the same about something.

And I never said that Spinosaurus fans don´t matter. What I am saying is that most of them at the very least understand the why behind the rematch. They know the Spino is not the icon of the franchise, they are fully aware that the T Rex is one of the biggest reasons why the first 2 films are so important to longtime fans. So many of them would not be so shocked or devastated if a rematch were to happen. That is what I am saying.

You just contradicted yourself here. With your first statement, you state that just because I feel a certain way doesn't mean others feel the same, which is fair. However, in the next statement, you pigeonholed "Spino fans" by saying that most of them "understand'.

Just because you think they do (or at least should) feel a certain way doesn't mean they do.

What about the example that I gave you about the scene with Eric and Dr Grant? That is within the movie. I did give you in universe examples that favor my argument. It is not like I only gave you out of universe arguments.

And while It is true that the interviews of producers are not within the movie, they do still count, because after all, it is the producers who dictate how the universe that they are creating works. So their intentions do matter and are very valid points in favor of what I am trying to say.

About Spino fans, all I did was say that most of them at the very least understand the why behind the rematch if explained to them. Notice that I said most. I never said that they all feel exactly the same way that I feel. I never implied that. So I never contradicted myself. Obviously there are some Spino fans who dislike the idea of their dinosaur getting defeated. What I am saying is that many of them know why that would happen.

Understanding why something happens does not mean you agree with it happening.

Megaspino2 wrote:

Here's the thing, there is no precedent canon wise or franchise wise that says T.rex will always loose to Spinosaurs or for that matter any other super predator. Franchise wise JP3 was a product of the filmmakers wanting to do their own thing with the JP series. The rex was the icon of Spielberg's first two Jurassic Park movies and Johnston wanted something of his own. Horner was called in and suggested spino as the new icon of their movie. There was nothing wrong with the idea but the execution is where things go wrong. I think they got all caught up in trying to make the spino look as ferocious and awesome as possible that they never stopped to question anything they were writing. It was a huge blunder and a stain on the franchise and Universal understands that. Notice how quickly the spino logo was taken off JP merchandise and replaced with the rex? Sure it's on the JP3 stuff but anything after that either features just the rex or the rex and spino together. JPOG which was released just a few years after JP3 has the rex back on the logo. Furthermore, if you check out the new Blu Ray releases for JP3 you will notice that the rex is on the cover in the style of the older movies. That means that despite the filmmakers doing their best (or worst) to try and replace the rex, it has endured meaning Universal has no intention of taking that one fight as canon moving forward. We can look at it as an "Oops" moment.

Canon wise there are a plethora of reasons that can explain why that particular rex lost to that spino. Many believe it was a sub adult and judging by the size chart that would be the most correct; others like to think it was the rex from TLW and the leg never healed or that particular rex was just not experienced in combat. Again it was one fight, it's not like we saw the spino slaughter 4 other rex in the course of the movie. For example, a lion is killed by a Cape Buffalo and applying that logic you might say "hm, I guess all lions will always get killed by buffalo." However, that is far from the truth, in reality lions hunt these buffalo and while the buffalo can kill lions, lions can also kill them.

And just because the JP rex got tossed around by the I.rex it doesn't mean the rex is inferior. The I.rex is supposed to be a genetic monster, having DNA of raptors, giganotosaur, t.rex and many other creatures. If the rex killed the I.rex easily plot wise there would be no tension, no action. It would just be over in a few seconds perhaps less than a minute and wait, doesn't that sound familiar?

Point is there is no basis for any kind of precedent. There was a fight in JP3, it was a one off scene that was poorly thought out, poorly executed and Universal has no intentions to revisit that. Having another fight is not going to make things any better and it is certainly not going to fix JP3. I personally don't think that many people are still sore over it, however if they are then they are. These people shouldn't get their hopes up though since it is clear that Universal has no intention of taking this any further than the spino skeleton reference in JW.

There is no line within the movies saying that the T Rexes will always lose,but it is heavily implied that the Spinosauruses are clearly the much superior species in many ways within the movie and behind the scenes of the movie like:

The entire marketing of Jurassic Park 3 centered around the idea that the Spino is much more deadly.
Jack Horner saying that the Spino could literaly cause the exctinction of the rest of the dinos on Sorna.
Jack Horner saying that he wanted to establish in the movie that T Rexes were the prey of Spinosauruses.
The rest of the cast and crew literaly saying that the T Rex does not stand a chance against the Spino.
The movie shows that a T Rex can bite a Spinosaurus on the neck and the Spino escapes unharmed.
While on the other hand the Spinosaurus is able to break the neck of the T Rex in literaly 2 seconds.
The scene where Eric tells Grant that the Spino loves to go after the T Rex whenever they smell them.
The movie overall shows that the Spinos is more intense and fierce (able to take a hit from a plane like nothing)

That is why this is not as simple as just one easy to ignore fight. There is much more to it than that.

And while fans have come up with theories trying to explain or justify why the T Rex lost, they are just that...Fan theories. None of those theories are oficial canon material.

I never really bought the theory that the T Rex that lost was a teenager for one very logical reason...If the producers at the time wanted to establish the clear superiority of the Spino against the T Rex, why would they have it kill only a teenage Rex? It sounds a lot more logical to make it kill an adult Rex to clearly showcase it´s superiority.

So if what fans hated is not just a lost fight but the establishment of the Spino species superiority over the T Rex then having an old Rex get quickly knocked out against yet another much more superior therapod is not exactly the best antidote. Much less when Rexy had to literally be saved from death by blue and did not even get to actually defeat the Indominus.

That is why there is still a big desire for a rematch. If Rexy would have defeated Indominus by herself then there would be almost no desire for a rematch. But she got quickly knocked out, nearly killed and had to be saved twice. (To me that was the most unsatisfying moment of Jurassic World).

By the way just out of curiosity... Has Universal or Colin Trevorrow or JA Bayona ever said that they are not going to ever bring anything Spinosaurus related on the sequel?

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

There is no line within the movies saying that the T Rexes will always lose,but it is heavily implied that the Spinosauruses are clearly the much superior species in many ways within the movie and behind the scenes of the movie like:

The entire marketing of Jurassic Park 3 centered around the idea that the Spino is much more deadly.
Jack Horner saying that the Spino could literaly cause the exctinction of the rest of the dinos on Sorna.
Jack Horner saying that he wanted to establish in the movie that T Rexes were the prey of Spinosauruses.
The rest of the cast and crew literaly saying that the T Rex does not stand a chance against the Spino.
The movie shows that a T Rex can bite a Spinosaurus on the neck and the Spino escapes unharmed.
While on the other hand the Spinosaurus is able to break the neck of the T Rex in literaly 2 seconds.
The scene where Eric tells Grant that the Spino loves to go after the T Rex whenever they smell them.
The movie overall shows that the Spinos is more intense and fierce (able to take a hit from a plane like nothing)

This is the result of JP3 numerous productions issues and Horner's rex hate meddling. Nothing more and nothing less. The idea of having a new apex predator star over the T.rex was interesting but the execution was mediocre. The best thing to do is just let it go and move on.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

That is why this is not as simple as just one easy to ignore fight.

With a little effort, it's fairly possible to do so.

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

So if what fans hated is not just a lost fight but the establishment of the Spino species superiority over the T Rex then having an old Rex get quickly knocked out against yet another much more superior therapod is not exactly the best antidote.
Much less when Rexy had to literally be saved from death by blue and did not even get to actually defeat the Indominus.
That is why there is still a big desire for a rematch. If Rexy would have defeated Indominus by herself then there would be almost no desire for a rematch. But she got quickly knocked out, nearly killed and had to be saved twice.

Rexy just came out of a dozen of years spent in captivity, she's old and the I.rex was designed on purpose to be bigger and stronger than a T.rex. So it's kinda normal that the fight was tough for her even if she quickly get the upper hand during the second part. And even if she defeated the I.rex with ease, I'm pretty sure that you or another of the rematch's advocates will be still begging the producers.
You do realize that Tyrannosaurs are supposed to be animals, not pokémons, right ?
Sometimes they win, sometimes they lose. It's life.

I'm all for debates but only on important matters such as lore, characters, world-building... but not for "Daddy, the other kid said last week that his toy was better than mine. Please tell him that mine is actually better than his"-like issues. That's good for special snowflakes toddlers, not for grown ups.

Seeing people wasting their time on such a futile subject makes me roll my eyes.

The Geeky Zoologist wrote:

I'm all for debates but only on important matters such as lore, characters, world-building... but not for "Daddy, the other kid said last week that his toy was better than mine. Please tell him that mine is actually better than his"-like issues. That's good for special snowflakes toddlers, not for grown ups.

I've discussed it with the rest of the forum, and we've collectively come to the decision that this post will receive all of the upvotes from here on in.