General Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom News Thread V.5

Pokesaurus wrote:

Alright folks, chill it, let's not turn this into a debate about SJWs, virtue signalling, etc. And try to keep a cool head, regardless of how personal the subject may be.

Sorry Pokesaurus. Had no mean to cause a fight, only exposing personal views/opinions.

I'll keep chill.

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

I'm so fucking mad that they cut it and people are saying it's not important or revelant to the franchise.

Having a scene where Zia mentions she's a lesbian would have been a great addition to the film (and a good way to show representation in this franchise, which is sorely lacking it), but the scene itself as the actress described would not be a great addition, and I'm really glad they cut it.

Again, that cut dialogue between Zia and Owen is extremely tone-deaf, and if it was included in the final movie, a lot of lesbians would probably have found it offensive rather than respectful. I even mentioned that news to a few female friends, and they all agreed that the dialogue is offensive.

Today is the big day, seeing the film tonight, only 9 hours to go, cannot wait , hope I won't be disappointed...

Mr. Robustus wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

I'm so fucking mad that they cut it and people are saying it's not important or revelant to the franchise.

Having a scene where Zia mentions she's a lesbian would have been a great addition to the film (and a good way to show representation in this franchise, which is sorely lacking it), but the scene itself as the actress described would not be a great addition, and I'm really glad they cut it.

Again, that cut dialogue between Zia and Owen is extremely tone-deaf, and if it was included in the final movie, a lot of lesbians would probably have found it offensive rather than respectful. I even mentioned that news to a few female friends, and they all agreed that the dialogue is offensive.

Yeah I agree. Having her saying "I'm lesbian" would be better. Plus it wouldn't hurt Zia taking 10 seconds to say this, to be honest.

Anyway, I get it as canon already. I hope we see more deleted scenes when the BR comes out.

To be honest, I had already kinda assumed as much regarding Zia anyways.

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Mr. Robustus wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

I'm so fucking mad that they cut it and people are saying it's not important or revelant to the franchise.

Having a scene where Zia mentions she's a lesbian would have been a great addition to the film (and a good way to show representation in this franchise, which is sorely lacking it), but the scene itself as the actress described would not be a great addition, and I'm really glad they cut it.

Again, that cut dialogue between Zia and Owen is extremely tone-deaf, and if it was included in the final movie, a lot of lesbians would probably have found it offensive rather than respectful. I even mentioned that news to a few female friends, and they all agreed that the dialogue is offensive.

Yeah I agree. Having her saying "I'm lesbian" would be better. Plus it wouldn't hurt Zia taking 10 seconds to say this, to be honest.

Anyway, I get it as canon already. I hope we see more deleted scenes when the BR comes out.

I feel like a 10 second conversation with her saying that comes off as extremely forced, and to be honest, there are probably better ways of expanding someone's character than randomly throwing their sexual orientation at the audience. Have her describe what it was like growing up with a girlfriend that loved dinosaurs. There are ways to say "this person prefers the same sex" over just flat out going "LESBIAN". That would work 100x better and is relevant to the story.

Dead2009 wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Mr. Robustus wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

I'm so fucking mad that they cut it and people are saying it's not important or revelant to the franchise.

Having a scene where Zia mentions she's a lesbian would have been a great addition to the film (and a good way to show representation in this franchise, which is sorely lacking it), but the scene itself as the actress described would not be a great addition, and I'm really glad they cut it.

Again, that cut dialogue between Zia and Owen is extremely tone-deaf, and if it was included in the final movie, a lot of lesbians would probably have found it offensive rather than respectful. I even mentioned that news to a few female friends, and they all agreed that the dialogue is offensive.

Yeah I agree. Having her saying "I'm lesbian" would be better. Plus it wouldn't hurt Zia taking 10 seconds to say this, to be honest.

Anyway, I get it as canon already. I hope we see more deleted scenes when the BR comes out.

I feel like a 10 second conversation with her saying that comes off as extremely forced, and to be honest, there are probably better ways of expanding someone's character than randomly throwing their sexual orientation at the audience. Have her describe what it was like growing up with a girlfriend that loved dinosaurs. There are ways to say "this person prefers the same sex" over just flat out going "LESBIAN". That would work 100x better and is relevant to the story.

Yeah that too. Just that I meant it wouldn't take too much time of the movie to develop that.

Sure, if it would be relevant to the discussion in the scene that's taking place. Otherwise I feel like it would come off as shock value. Kinda like how the divorce thing in the last film was completely irrelevant until at the very end when it brought a family together.

The whole divorce thing was integral to two of the characters of the last movie. The whole lesbian thing would of been neat but the scene in question sounded really cringy

Herrerasaurus wrote:

The whole divorce thing was integral to two of the characters of the last movie. The whole lesbian thing would of been neat but the scene in question sounded really cringy

Yeah yet nobody questioned the divorce thing so I would pay no mind to things like this.

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Herrerasaurus wrote:

The whole divorce thing was integral to two of the characters of the last movie. The whole lesbian thing would of been neat but the scene in question sounded really cringy

Yeah yet nobody questioned the divorce thing so I would pay no mind to things like this.

Everyone did, lol.

Dead2009 wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Herrerasaurus wrote:

The whole divorce thing was integral to two of the characters of the last movie. The whole lesbian thing would of been neat but the scene in question sounded really cringy

Yeah yet nobody questioned the divorce thing so I would pay no mind to things like this.

Everyone did, lol.

Not as much they are doing with Zia, but okay.

I just hope the rest of the deleted scenes are good.

Characterization and exposition has sadly always ended up on the cutting room floor for JP movies, which is really disappointing. Anything that would have added depth to any character would be welcomed by me.

Indeed. The deleted scene between Roland and Ajay from TLW is the scene that really comes to mind.

I don’t care about politics, I want that 2 and a half hour cut baby!!!! Unfinished effects or not.

Dead2009 wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Mr. Robustus wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

I'm so fucking mad that they cut it and people are saying it's not important or revelant to the franchise.

Having a scene where Zia mentions she's a lesbian would have been a great addition to the film (and a good way to show representation in this franchise, which is sorely lacking it), but the scene itself as the actress described would not be a great addition, and I'm really glad they cut it.

Again, that cut dialogue between Zia and Owen is extremely tone-deaf, and if it was included in the final movie, a lot of lesbians would probably have found it offensive rather than respectful. I even mentioned that news to a few female friends, and they all agreed that the dialogue is offensive.

Yeah I agree. Having her saying "I'm lesbian" would be better. Plus it wouldn't hurt Zia taking 10 seconds to say this, to be honest.

Anyway, I get it as canon already. I hope we see more deleted scenes when the BR comes out.

I feel like a 10 second conversation with her saying that comes off as extremely forced, and to be honest, there are probably better ways of expanding someone's character than randomly throwing their sexual orientation at the audience. Have her describe what it was like growing up with a girlfriend that loved dinosaurs. There are ways to say "this person prefers the same sex" over just flat out going "LESBIAN". That would work 100x better and is relevant to the story.

This! If Zia doesn’t have a love interest or had one in the past story then her sexuality is pretty irrelevant to the story and it would feel forced to say it. It’d be like a character randomly telling you they are straight.

Dr Wu could be gay/bi or Hoskins, or countless other characters but it doesn’t matter because it has no bearing on the story they are in at the time.

Edit: also not trying to cause controversy.  But Colin has got enough trouble trying to develop his characters as is with these short run times and little to no backstory for some characters. Much less their love life. Some of these people could be really memorable with more screen time. But sadly the little moments just like this are cut like @CT-1138 said.

CT-1138 wrote:

Characterization and exposition has sadly always ended up on the cutting room floor for JP movies, which is really disappointing. Anything that would have added depth to any character would be welcomed by me.

This 100%.

I think I'm glad Zia's scene was cut. Not for the fact she's lesbian or so (no problem with that), but because of the dialogue being actually a bit badly written and not that necessary to the plot.
Also, it would have been cool for the character's depth, but I don't think it was needed for the film.

Maybe a deleted scene about Wu talking about science, or a further scene of Claire dealing with her past, or something like that, now THAT is something I would have wanted to be added in the theatrical version.

Also, Diego, I don't agree about Malcolm's lines being useless. Especially when you go so mad about Zia not having her lesbian dialogue. Like, I think Malcolm's lines about science, dinosaurs, human avidity and change was a little bit more important than knowing about Zia being lesbian.

owenpratt wrote:

I think I'm glad Zia's scene was cut. Not for the fact she's lesbian or so (no problem with that), but because of the dialogue being actually a bit badly written and not that necessary to the plot.
Also, it would have been cool for the character's depth, but I don't think it was needed for the film.

Maybe a deleted scene about Wu talking about science, or a further scene of Claire dealing with her past, or something like that, now THAT is something I would have wanted to be added in the theatrical version.

Also, Diego, I don't agree about Malcolm's lines being useless. Especially when you go so mad about Zia not having her lesbian  dialogue. Like, I think Malcolm's lines about science, dinosaurs, human avidity and change was a little bit more important than knowing about Zia being lesbian.

If there's a deleted scene about Wu (something I'm almost fully certain there is, given the pic I sent you yesterday of the card...), I'll be 100% mad. Specially if it fleshes out his character more than what we saw.
I'm sure there's a deleted scene of Owen searching for Blue, like extended scene. In my JW FK album, you have one card with Owen in the jungle searching for Blue and a crocodile skeleton close to him.


IMO Malcolm was there just for fanservice. He added nothing. We already knew what his opinion would be since TLW. He didn't say anything new, just the obvious.

Oh and what he thinks of science: "It's a rape to the natural world".

IMO Malcolm's lines are on pair with Zia's useless lines too. They are both useless and add nothing, but yet it was cool to see.

Next movie I want to see someone incorporate the Oppenheimer monologue, now that's something interesting and NEW.

Troyal1 wrote:

This! If Zia doesn’t have a love interest or had one in the past story then her sexuality is pretty irrelevant to the story and it would feel forced to say it. It’d be like a character randomly telling you they are straight.

Dr Wu could be gay/bi or Hoskins, or countless other characters but it doesn’t matter because it has no bearing on the story they are in at the time.

This, no one is complaining that Franklin didn't have a scene explaining his sexuality. It was simply not relevant at any moment in the film.

It would have been cool from a representation standpoint, but only if they could find a way to mention it organically without it feeling forced, which the scene in question kind of does.

And either way Zia is still a lesbian. Just because they didn't spell it out in the film doesn't mean she's straight now.

Yes, but if Malcolm's lines were useless, than Zia's cut dialogue was even more useless, so why being mad at its absence?

By the way, agree to disagree about Malcolm. I think they were pretty cool lines by Malcolm that helps understanding the sense of the film (especially for the ones who haven't read the novels).

In this case, I think Zia’s dialogue being cut is ok, because that would’ve been an extremely out of place feeling line, and I think it probably would’ve triggered some people. That said, Trevorrow seems to really have this thing for third act... awkwardness for no reason. Basically what I mean is, to me, this would’ve been this film’s “Lowery tries to kiss the woman with a boyfriend” scene.

owenpratt wrote:

Yes, but if Malcolm's lines were useless, than Zia's cut dialogue was even more useless, so why being mad at its absence?

By the way, agree to disagree about Malcolm. I think they were pretty cool lines by Malcolm that helps understanding the sense of the film (especially for the ones who haven't read the novels).

That's why I'm saying it's hipocrital of these people to say Zia's lines are irrelevant while thinking it's okay to put Malcolm with irrelevant lines just for the fanservice. If they are right to cut Zia's line because they are irrelevant, they should cut other irrelevant lines in the movie too. See?


Meh. Malcolm is overrated. He can say whatever the shit he wants and people will clap like the second coming of Jesus. And movie Malcolm is nowhere close to the novel one.

Novel Malcolm>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Movie Malcolm

Novel Malcolm actually explains where he comes from and doesn't use flat moralism to attack science. He really is Crichton's voice. Oh and he's more serious too.

I don't need Malcolm to tell me obvious stuff I get in the movie.

Again, agree to disagree about FK Malcolm. I think his little role was cool.

owenpratt wrote:

Again, agree to disagree about FK Malcolm. I think his little role was cool.

It was but IMO total irrelevant, just fanservice, but okay.

I wouldn't call Malcolm irrelevant. They needed someone to argue against saving the dinosaurs in the hearing scene, so why not Malcolm? It makes sense that he would argue against saving them and his opinion would be respected because of his experience with the islands and the fact that he's a famous mathematician. If it was some random scientist or government official arguing against saving them, it wouldn't hold the same weight as we don't know the character from the previous films.

Spoiler:

I agree that it was also fan service, but imo it was the good kind of fan service.

Dilophosaurus wrote:

I wouldn't call Malcolm irrelevant. They needed someone to argue against saving the dinosaurs in the hearing scene, so why not Malcolm? It makes sense that he would argue against saving them and his opinion would be respected because of his experience with the islands and the fact that he's a famous mathematician. If it was some random scientist or government official arguing against saving them, it wouldn't hold the same weight as we don't know the character from the previous films.

Spoiler:

I agree that it was also fan service, but imo it was the good kind of fan service.

Could put Grant or Ellie IMO wouldn't change anything. What makes me angry with his character is that he doesn't use fractal geometry or his maths to be against everything. He just uses flat moralism, but I'm fine with him appearing, just that his lines didn't get me much as everyone is saying. It was okay.

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Dilophosaurus wrote:

I wouldn't call Malcolm irrelevant. They needed someone to argue against saving the dinosaurs in the hearing scene, so why not Malcolm? It makes sense that he would argue against saving them and his opinion would be respected because of his experience with the islands and the fact that he's a famous mathematician. If it was some random scientist or government official arguing against saving them, it wouldn't hold the same weight as we don't know the character from the previous films.

Spoiler:

I agree that it was also fan service, but imo it was the good kind of fan service.

Could put Grant or Ellie IMO wouldn't change anything. What makes me angry with his character is that he doesn't use fractal geometry or his maths to be against everything. He just uses flat moralism, but I'm fine with him appearing, just that his lines didn't get me much as everyone is saying. It was okay.

Using Grant and Ellie would have been very different. Ellie would have no place in such hearing and Grant's character probably could care less about what happens to the dinosaurs. Malcolm was always very much against playing god so he would be very fitting when discussing man made creatures. His lines were pretty simple though.

Amadieus wrote:

Spinosaur4.4 wrote:

Dilophosaurus wrote:

I wouldn't call Malcolm irrelevant. They needed someone to argue against saving the dinosaurs in the hearing scene, so why not Malcolm? It makes sense that he would argue against saving them and his opinion would be respected because of his experience with the islands and the fact that he's a famous mathematician. If it was some random scientist or government official arguing against saving them, it wouldn't hold the same weight as we don't know the character from the previous films.

Spoiler:

I agree that it was also fan service, but imo it was the good kind of fan service.

Could put Grant or Ellie IMO wouldn't change anything. What makes me angry with his character is that he doesn't use fractal geometry or his maths to be against everything. He just uses flat moralism, but I'm fine with him appearing, just that his lines didn't get me much as everyone is saying. It was okay.

Using Grant and Ellie would have been very different. Ellie would have no place in such hearing and Grant's character probably could care less about what happens to the dinosaurs. Malcolm was always very much against playing god so he would be very fitting when discussing man made creatures. His lines were pretty simple though.

It's not playing God, it's science, Mr. Malcolm.


Sorry just poking around.

Malcolm was relevant as the DPG was seeking congressional approval for their mission basically. He played a part in congress not approving a bill to rescue the dinosaurs, thus leaving the DPG to turn to Lockwood and illegal means to perform their task. Imagine if he had not been in the film and congress simply said we should rescue the dinosaurs, it would be a film only about rounding them up before the volcano erupted.